1/32 su-27 ub flanker "zacto parts required ??"

[leverancier]

yes they had redone the single seater

I have it

but not good enough

regarding the tails they are higher

see pics below on the right the ub version

I am adding a comparaison with the nose on dry fit too

pics at same angle and same distance I prefer zacto shape

your thought guys ??

Really, the difference is just too small to justify the costs of the zacto-parts. But hey, it's your money.

[Youngtiger1]

Dude, ask your girlfriend if she's got a sister.......lol I need a girlfriend that will buy me a $200 kit. Anyway, I'm just kidding. Like the other have said, I hope you will do an online build and post a lot of photos. Thanks for sharing...

Mike

[Zactoman]

????? looks identical to me. So the zacto parts seem a total waste of money.

Really, the difference is just too small to justify the costs of the zacto-parts. But hey, it's your money.

Wow...How to reply to comments like this?

Trying not to sound like a politician but still win your vote...

I am a small business, a one man operation, struggling lately to stay afloat. The current economy has hurt everybody and my sales have dropped a lot as a result.

I got my start here on ARC when Trumpeter released the single seat Flanker and I decided I'd fix some of the obvious problems with the kit.

I did my best to not only correct the parts but to do so as accurately as I could and add as much extra detail as I could to those parts.

I spent countless hours researching and making the masters, not settling for 'good enough' but going the extra mile to make my masters even better.

I've done my best to deliver the parts quickly and provide the very best in quality castings.

I tend to toss any castings that have any flaws what-so-ever. I've saved lots of castings that had minor flaws and have accumulated a big box full of parts that would have been plenty good enough for most aftermarket companies. They're still not good enough for me...

I pour new molds as soon as the old molds start to show any signs of deterioration. I'd like to think that the parts I ship today are every bit as good as those that I shipped just over three years ago when I started the business.

I've done my best to keep my prices low only raising them a few bucks since starting despite the rise in costs of materials, postage costs, vendor costs and the overall cost of living. I wish I could drop my prices to make these parts more attractive to those who are considering but not buying them.

Are my Su-27 parts 'necessary' now that Trumpeter has 're-tooled' the kit?

You obviously don't think so...

I honestly believe that they are a much higher quality than the 'new' kit parts and they will enhance your model.

Unfortunately the new kit is about $200 so spending the extra money on my parts is a stretch for most.

I recently ordered the kit and am waiting for it to be delivered.

I've seen the parts in person but not side-by-side with my parts other than the pictures posted here on ARC.

I am convinced that they are nearly direct copies of my parts (even more convinced because I received an e-mail (from a third party) over 6 months before the 're-tooled' parts were released informing me that Trumpeter had a set of my parts and was using them as their "main reference". As mentioned in a previous thread), especially since they even copied my mistakes.

I'd ask two questions:

1. Would Trumpeter have 're-tooled' these parts if I hadn't received so much support for my correction set?

2. If they had 're-tooled' them would they have gotten the shapes correct this time around without using my parts as their "main reference"?

Regardless, the end result is that my sales have dropped big time...

I am grateful to those of you who have supported my business and to those who will continue to order the parts.

I'll do my best to keep producing good stuff for you!

Thank you for your support Ghostkiller! Your parts will ship tomorrow.

Give my very best to your girlfriend!

[fulcrum]

It's very simple as with other kits:

If u want t build a nice scale model without investing some additional money in aftermarket goodies, go with it.

If u are a guy who loves to work on details and getting accurate shapes and proportions with not enough time for scratchbuilding then go with resin, PE, decals, etc, etc...

Both choices drives you to this hobby's main purpose: FUN

IMHO I will consider at least a pair of Zactomodels items for my future 1/32 Flanker and I will get fun at the end of the day.

Cheers.

[fulcrum]

I tend to toss any castings that have any flaws what-so-ever. I've saved lots of castings that had minor flaws and have accumulated a big box full of parts that would have been plenty good enough for most aftermarket companies. They're still not good enough for me...

I use to do the same when casting resin... plenty of boxes full of them.

Hey Chris, why not selling those minor flaw resin parts at half price through ARC forum then some of us could save some money and u could improve your sales????

I will be interested on those fixable spares and surely some other ARCers will support as well.... :thumbsup:

Cheers.

[Youngtiger1]

Zactomans resin is Top notch and must have if you're working on a Su-27. As for the 2 seater Su-27 I'll still go with most of his stuff. Heck, I would love to see this Chinese company starts paying on it's royalties to Chris. If it wasn't for him I would have never purchased the Su-27, A-7E, Mig-29M, and soon to add to the collection F-100.

Chris, I'm sorry to hear that your sales are slow but I will do my part to support you any time. Beside, I know that YF-23 is going to be a big chunk but hey I gotta have me one of those bad boys. So, keep up the good work....

Mike

[etripke]

Here comes the flanker expert

thks and yes I will update

I have a full set from zacto so I will build the 2 seater first and do dry fit first to see if I really need another nose and air intakes from zactoman

trust me it changes the bird look a lot

and ohhhh my god I need room 3 flanker in 1/32

Who, if anyone makes the 1/32 Ukrainian markings? I have looked all over to no avail.

[loftycomfort]

Who, if anyone makes the 1/32 Ukrainian markings? I have looked all over to no avail.

Linden Hill has announced them on their site.

[etripke]

Linden Hill has announced them on their site.

Outstanding! Thanks for the heads up.

[Ghostkiller]

thks Zactoman

to those who have never seen zacto parts and never had zacto parts in hands

trust the first thing that you will think is : zactoman is not human

freaking awesome job !!!!!

I see modeling the following way

My girl friend bought me a high price kit ====> 110 euros in France

not 200 usd but still expensive

for such a high price kit if there is something that can bring this kit to the next level I will go for it if I can afford it

If I can make it look awesome I would

I am looking for a fully detailled kit

And yes I will post progression pics

I am not a pro but I always try my best

my last 1/32 flanker with zacto parts ;)

it might includes the aires weel bays and exhaust that I bought for the single seat

will need in this case the same set for the single seat again

too bad there is not resin cockpit for the UB :)

I am still thinking about the camo and might actually make a custom camo by the way

I hope you guys will enjoy it

so get ready for the starts : let me finish my tamiya 1/32 F-16cj first B)

the 1/32 flanker fully corrected single seat will be for later cause I am too excited now with the UB version

cheers

Edited October 20, 2008 by Ghostkiller

[RedCrown]

Wow...How to reply to comments like this?

Trying not to sound like a politician but still win your vote...

I am a small business, a one man operation, struggling lately to stay afloat. The current economy has hurt everybody and my sales have dropped a lot as a result.

I got my start here on ARC when Trumpeter released the single seat Flanker and I decided I'd fix some of the obvious problems with the kit.

I did my best to not only correct the parts but to do so as accurately as I could and add as much extra detail as I could to those parts.

I spent countless hours researching and making the masters, not settling for 'good enough' but going the extra mile to make my masters even better.

I've done my best to deliver the parts quickly and provide the very best in quality castings.

I tend to toss any castings that have any flaws what-so-ever. I've saved lots of castings that had minor flaws and have accumulated a big box full of parts that would have been plenty good enough for most aftermarket companies. They're still not good enough for me...

I pour new molds as soon as the old molds start to show any signs of deterioration. I'd like to think that the parts I ship today are every bit as good as those that I shipped just over three years ago when I started the business.

I've done my best to keep my prices low only raising them a few bucks since starting despite the rise in costs of materials, postage costs, vendor costs and the overall cost of living. I wish I could drop my prices to make these parts more attractive to those who are considering but not buying them.

Are my Su-27 parts 'necessary' now that Trumpeter has 're-tooled' the kit?

You obviously don't think so...

I honestly believe that they are a much higher quality than the 'new' kit parts and they will enhance your model.

Unfortunately the new kit is about $200 so spending the extra money on my parts is a stretch for most.

I recently ordered the kit and am waiting for it to be delivered.

I've seen the parts in person but not side-by-side with my parts other than the pictures posted here on ARC.

I am convinced that they are nearly direct copies of my parts (even more convinced because I received an e-mail (from a third party) over 6 months before the 're-tooled' parts were released informing me that Trumpeter had a set of my parts and was using them as their "main reference". As mentioned in a previous thread), especially since they even copied my mistakes.

I'd ask two questions:

1. Would Trumpeter have 're-tooled' these parts if I hadn't received so much support for my correction set?

2. If they had 're-tooled' them would they have gotten the shapes correct this time around without using my parts as their "main reference"?

Regardless, the end result is that my sales have dropped big time...

I am grateful to those of you who have supported my business and to those who will continue to order the parts.

I'll do my best to keep producing good stuff for you!

Thank you for your support Ghostkiller! Your parts will ship tomorrow.

Give my very best to your girlfriend!

:)

Chris,

I purchased your set and am extremely impressed with the quality and detail.You are definitely a master craftsman.I'm sorry to see that your sales are down because of Trumpeter ripping you off. One suggestion to improve your sales; how about making a Su-33 conversion to package with your update set. I doubt Trumpeter would follow that, and I think the demand is there based on how much the SOL 1/48 conversion fetches on Ebay. I would definitely buy another set if you did that. I am also waiting for the Revell Mig-29A set and am looking forward to the YF-23 kit as well.Keep up the awesome work, and thanks for doing it.

Rick

[leverancier]

SU-33 conversion...now that I would buy!

[Flankerman]

SU-33 conversion...now that I would buy!

The Su-33 is quite a radical conversion......

As well as Zactoman's existing correction set, you would need completely new wings, canards and a new tailboom.

.....and a new twin nosewheel.

If you wanted folding wings, that would be an extra complication - including a folding tailplane.

Quite a bit of resin.......

Ken

[fulcrum]

The Su-33 is quite a radical conversion......

As well as Zactoman's existing correction set, you would need completely new wings, canards and a new tailboom.

.....and a new twin nosewheel.

If you wanted folding wings, that would be an extra complication - including a folding tailplane.

Quite a bit of resin.......

Ken

Not to mention the in-flight refueling probe, the canards shoulders, new windscreen with offset IRST all that means a new forward fuselage section and I guess the MLG struts are some thicker, at the end of the day u will use only the central fuselage from the original plastic kit, everything else is different on Korabelni Flankers.

[illithid00]

Wow...How to reply to comments like this?

<snip>

Zacto, as soon as I save up the money, I'll be getting your parts for my Flanker build.

[Zactoman]

Hey Chris, why not selling those minor flaw resin parts at half price through ARC forum then some of us could save some money and u could improve your sales????

I have considered doing this but have decided against it for one main reason:

If the parts were to some day be resold they would not be representative of the quality of product that I sell.

Besides, with the exception of some Su-27 nosecones (for some reason I end up with lots of these with arm hairs cast in...) none of the rejects are complete sets. I'd still have to cast several pieces to make full kits so I might as well cast full sets anyways...

...how about making a Su-33 conversion to package with your update set.

As mentioned, this would be a relatively monumental undertaking.

I've already got too many of those on my plate.

Perhaps some day though...

Thanks again for all the support and words of encouragement.

Sorry for my previous babbling diatribe.

I am just passionate about my work and hearing it described as "a total waste of money" just rubbed me the wrong way...

SU-33 conversion...now that I would buy!

:)

;)

[karl h]

i´m waiting for your mig 29A set, got your A-7 set an am really happy with it

[leverancier]

I have considered doing this but have decided against it for one main reason:

If the parts were to some day be resold they would not be representative of the quality of product that I sell.

Besides, with the exception of some Su-27 nosecones (for some reason I end up with lots of these with arm hairs cast in...) none of the rejects are complete sets. I'd still have to cast several pieces to make full kits so I might as well cast full sets anyways...

As mentioned, this would be a relatively monumental undertaking.

I've already got too many of those on my plate.

Perhaps some day though...

Thanks again for all the support and words of encouragement.

Sorry for my previous babbling diatribe.

I am just passionate about my work and hearing it described as "a total waste of money" just rubbed me the wrong way...

I'm sorry you feel that way, but I wasn't talking about the quality of your products. Only about the fact that Trumpeter has pushed you out of the market by correcting their mistakes.

I was only talking about the nose though, the canopy frame and intakes are still way better than theirs.

[benjo]

Hey Zactoman i sent you an email trying to get some bits from you dont you want my money!!!!!!!!

I need them to finish my SU-33!

It may not be accurate by zactomans standards but it will definately help to make it fit on the shelf LOL.

I might not go as far as increasing the wing area but ill do all the detail in the wing fold and tail, dual nosewheel dont know how ill manage the windscreen but ill work it out when the time comes.

Benny

[Firecaptain]

FYI........

Great Models has the UB on sale for $113.40........I had to jump on it for that price! That is CHEAP as in like a little over 40% off SRP cheap!

Never thought I'd be touting a $100+ kit as cheap......lol.......oh well it's modern Soviet AND 1/32!

Edited October 21, 2008 by Firecaptain

[Zactoman]

I'm sorry you feel that way, but I wasn't talking about the quality of your products. Only about the fact that Trumpeter has pushed you out of the market by correcting their mistakes.

I was only talking about the nose though, the canopy frame and intakes are still way better than theirs.

As I previously mentioned, it was your choice of words...

And Trumpeter didn't push me out of the market "by correcting their mistakes". I corrected the mistakes. They pushed me out of the market by copying my work...

As for the nosecone:

On the left is the original Trump Su-27B nosecone. Note how it swells outward toward the front. It's also short by approx. 3/16".

In the center is the new 'retooled' nosecone. It has been lengthened and is much more streamlined.

On the right is the Zactomodels nosecone. Note the subtle kink/swell about half way down the forward cone. Also note the difference in the panel lines. This becomes very obvious when the model is painted as the dielectric panel (the large squarish panel on the Zactopart vs. the more rectangular panel on the Trump part) is usually white or dark green and really stands out on the light blue camo. And then there's the pitot.

I can spot the Zactomodel from across the room...

FYI........

Great Models has the UB on sale for $113.40........I had to jump on it for that price! That is CHEAP as in like a little over 40% off SRP cheap!

Mine arrived today!

First thing I had to do was to compare the intakes with mine. Now I have no doubts...

First the outer sides:

The big difference is the surface detail. The most critical area to me is the louvered vent detail. Though Trump improved it from their original release it's still just straight scribe lines rather than angled louvers. Plus the mad-riveter struck again! The biggest problem with this is around those louvers as the rivets are a much bigger and more dominant feature than the louvers.

I'm surprised that they didn't add the hole and gear latching mechanism.

Next pic is the inner surface between the intakes:

Again the louvers are the dominant difference.

As noted in a previous thread, two of the rectangular access panels should have been rounded but I didn't have any clear photos when I made the patterns. I guess Trumpeter didn't have any clear photos either and just happened to fake the panels exactly like I did...

The underside of the intakes:

Here you can see how the contours match up. The Trump parts have a slightly bigger radius next to their narrower bypass doors. I'm guessing this was to make the part easier to mold since they are using a four part tool.

Also note that they didn't correct the shape of the triangular ECM blade antenna or add the mounting plate for the landing gear brace hump.

Here are some of the differences and extras included with the Zactomodels parts:

They didn't change the geometry or add the hole pattern on the splitter plates but did widen them. They also widened the FOD guards,,, by adding an extra row to the grid! Now their grid is nine squares wide which puts the latch in the center.

I'm really surprised that they didn't make these corrections since they had to retool the parts anyways. With the geometry of the FOD guards now, if they were to fold down they would stick out of the front of the intake by a quarter inch...

They still don't offer an option to display it with the FOD guard down, though they re-tooled the intake fan? (which didn't show before and still doesn't...).

Still no detail on the inside of the lower intake panel which does show...

I'd say Aires has a right to be upset as well.

Here are the exhausts:

On the left are the original Su-27B parts.

Center are the new tooled parts.

On the right are the Aires parts.

Though they made a bunch of corrections they left the big wart/rivets on them...

Next up, Trumpeter-bashing! :D

Not for the weak-of-heart!

Small children and anti-Trumpeter-bashers should immediately change the channel and leave the room!

[Zactoman]

Several people have asked me what I think of the new canopy. Since I only just received the model today I've held back my comments. Here goes...

Left is the previous Su-27B, center the new Su-27ub and right is the previous Zactomodels Su-27B correction.

For some reason Trumpeter decided to make the windscreen much narrower than on the Su-27B.

Note how much wider my previous correction is at the front of the windscreen.

Checking multiple photos and drawings it appears that the Su-27ub has the same windscreen as the Su-27B...

So it appears that the canopy is pinched and too pointy at the front end...And the IRST fairing is too small...

Unfortunately I have too many projects going on right now to make a correction...

Sorry.

Perhaps some day in the future...

Then there is another small discrepancy that would be much more difficult to fix:

There should be a contour where the fuselage meets the LERX. The radius of the contour is subtle and passes just above the gun panel and gets tighter as it approaches the front of the plane.

It's a subtle feature that shows up in certain photos when the lighting is right...>>>Here<<< for instance.

Despite the problems it's a nice kit if you can buy one for closer to $100.00.

A definite improvement over the Su-27B :D

:D

[janman]

Considering the already high price of the kit, I would think the UB version should work reasonably well without the Zacto set.

Thanks for the comparison! I take my words back. Seems that even after Trumpeter's corrections many things are way off...

[Flankerman]

I agree with everything you say Chris - but just one small nitpick - and I am surprised at you !!!!!

You must be having an off day... :)

There is no such thing as a Su-27B....... :D

It's a Su-27 Flanker B (the ASCC Reporting name).

Su-27, no suffix, pronounced 'Soo', not 'Ess You', capital S small u, first two letters of Pavel Sukhoi's last name.

The tandem two seater is Su-27UB (for Uchebno Boyevoy - Combat Trainer).

It's ASCC Reporting name is 'Flanker C'.

Sorry.... I get a bit anal about these things.......

Ken

PS - That's ASCC (Air Standardization Co-ordinating Committe)- not NATO - as it includes Australia & New Zealand - another thing that winds me up when I see 'NATO Codename' :D

PPS ASCC is now ASIC - Air and Space Interoperability Council

I'll get down off my soapbox now......

[jenshb]

Hehehe...even when Trumpeter are copying parts they still mess up...:D Very well done comparison and research Zactoman - some pretty weighty arguments there.

Jens