B-17 Differences

[Bugfan]

Could someone explain the differences between the B-17F and the B-17G? Your help is greatly appreciated!!

Jack aka BUGFAN

[Dave Williams]

The dig difference is the chin turret on the -G. Also, -Gs had the projecting cheek gun positions and windows for the waist guns. Later -Gs had the Cheyenne tail turret and staggered waist windows.

[Irishfan]

Hello Everyone:

Jack, Dave is right about the guns on the B-17's, if you go online and look at the noses on the B-17's you will see the differences.

B-17E and F are pretty much identical in appearance, there is some minor differences here and there,

The G is the one with the Noticable improvements,

if you build a 1/48 version, I would recommend the G kit, it is made by revell/monogram, the kit is a bit dated in some areas and some correcting is needed in other areas, that is if you wan't everything correct to the prototype,

The revell B-17F is the only 1/48 version, this kit lacks a lot of interior detals, I recommend taking a monogram B-17G for the radio area, and for the cockpit / bombadier area, unless you get some good resin conversion parts, the revell kit lacks interior details, it is more or less a good ceiling hanger unless you do the mentioned mods.

as for the other scales, I don't know anything about the 1/72nd stuff, I do know of the 1/32nd ones and those require a lot of time and patience.

B-17F

http://afhra.maxwell.af.mil/photo_gallerie...0910460_122.jpg

http://www.303rdbg.com/na-cato9tails.jpg

B-17G

http://www.taphilo.com/photo/pictures/B17-texas-Raider.jpg

both of those links will give you an idea on the nose,

take care

George

[Bugfan]

THANKS Dave and George!! MOST HELPFUL!!

PRE SHE ATE IT!!!!

Jack aka BUGFAN

[Bob Perry]

My references are out on loan, but it seems to me the differences between the F and G are more incremental than cut-and-dried. I have seen a reference to the early G being very similar to the late F, with the standardisation of all the F model changes. For example, the G is known for the chin turret, but some late Fs also had it.

The incremental changes continued after the start of G production. The G acquired staggered waist windows, but not all did. There were at least three styles of waist window though where one ended and the next began is a mystery to me. And the Cheyenne tail was a retrofit to the G after the airframe was produced but before unit issue. Again it would be incorrect to state categorically that all Gs after some date or serial had it. I've never seen one on an F.

The hand held nose guns especially on the G went through a number of arrangements as well with varying window arrangements and armour.

It all comes back to the old rule about modelling from photographs.

In 1/72 Hasegawa's kits are very good, needing some detailing but little refining. Watch out for the too-small Cheyenne tail on the G. Academy's get good ink too.

Edited July 16, 2007 by Bob Perry

[jrallman]

Everyone has been correct, for the most part. One of the things you will find about B-17 (and other plane) production is that the farming out of production to several different facilities meant that changes were not always uniform or simultaneous. The cheek window configuration changed several times throughout the F series but was, for the most part, standardized by the G, but some early G models still had F style windows. Similarly, the chin turret overlapped into the late F models, and the lack of chin turret overlapped into some early G models. There was a discussion on this board earlier about when the switch to staggered waist windows and cheyene tails appeared, so a quick search will get you that info. With B-17s, sometimes more than any other plane, a good reference is key to accuracy, if thats what you are after of course.

[Irishfan]

Hello Jack

Bob and jrallman and Dave is right

I forget about all of this stuff , BRAIN FARTS

another problem arises,

Which B-17 to build, with all of the decals that are available, there is quite a few, I remember one member on the boards custom printing a correct set for the 909.

also Field mods, a lot of these kits come as stock factory kits based on the basic model, while there was some planes that were modded over time in the field and the kit needs to be modified if you want to represent one.

the Cheyenne turret is easy to do, thanks to it being made by 3 places, the staggered waist guns is a fun project :D

the part that gets nuts is backdating some of these birds, Bill Koster makes a kit that backdates the F and G to a C, D, or E.

I am currently working on a B-17F Panama Hattie ( MIKE GRANT DECALS ) and a B-17G Lil Patches (AEROMASTER DECALS)

I had to get off my duff, these planes have been sitting for 2 years on a shelf,

I am working on a B-25 at the moment, 50% done

my suggestion is pick up a Squadron walk around book on the B-17, or Combat Legend B-17 both of these books are helpful and I recommend them.

if you want to model a particular plane that is at the airshows, there is a problem with that,

you will have to get custom decals, the 909 was produced by super scale, the bad part is the fact it is out of print and people on ebay are nuts.

I would recommend doing it in 1/48 though, there is more aftermarket parts for the Monogram B-17G kit, you can easily go overboard building one.

as I mentioned before, if you build a 1/48 B-17F, the revell kit is out of production, and the lack of details suck, I usually buy a scrap B-17G from online or at a show and put the interior parts inside the F,

as for 1/72nd, ask the board members, I don't build 1/72nd that much, except Jets for a friend.

if you do an F, I recommend the Mike Grant Set Seattle Warbirds, it is a nice set with 3 options for planes that were stationed in the PTO, rather than the typical variety of the ETO stuff, sorry if I sound mean, but I have seen way too many decals for the ETO and hardly any in the PTO for B-17's.

Zotz makes and awesome set for the F, but I only recommend it for the serious modeler, not all of us are gonna buy 3 or 4 B-17's , well I did, LOL.

oh another note, if you like the Plane SHOO SHOO BABY a B-17G at the Wright Patterson Museum, there is a decal set, but one problem

it is incorrect if you want to do the museum version, the decals are for the war time version which was an all natural aluminum B-17G, when the museum restored it, they painted it in the two tone camo,

take care

George

http://mysite.verizon.net/res8zcvf/sitebui...es/bell-fly.jpg

Edited July 16, 2007 by Irishfan

[theplasticsurgeon]

F had hydraulic intercooler controls, G had electrical - or the other way around. BUT you can't tell that on a model!

The final production block of F's had the chin turret - which is quoted as the recognition feature for G version.

Within each version, the breed improved with each production block, so a late F is visibly different to an early F. Similar with G versions.

Best to get the books out and look at pictures of a particular plane you want to model.

[Hawk10]

I have several B-17 references which would indicate that without the a/c sn, you couldn't really tell the difference between the late B-17Fs and the early B-17Gs as the major differences were all internal.