Armoryman Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 (edited) Gretings! I'm beginner at this forum, so, I'm sorry if something frong. I'd like to ask about ideas - where can be used M134 "Minimun"? I've prepared a time ago its CAD model for my own pleasure and now want to make small series of this item. Another question: how do You think: does it need some more details into the set, or already made body will be enough? Thanks for all the replies! Please take a look at the CAD model screenshots: Edited December 2, 2009 by Armoryman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Intruder_bass Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Привет славяне! Looks great! Just out of curiosity what drawings did you use fro the model? What scale are you planning to print it in? Andriy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HeavyArty Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Looks good to me. As to where they are used, just about everywhere. They were used on pulon mounts during the vietnam timeframe. For US use, the USMC uses them as doorgums on UH-1Ns. HH/MH-60s use them in the doorgunner positions as well. They are also used on MH-47s, etc. I'm sure many other counrties use them as well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Avus Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Some can have a spent shell dipenser on the body and also a big muzzle flash suppressor covering all the barrel ends or a single muzzle flash suppressor for each barrel. But the basic body looks great. I didn't quite understand: are you going to make real scale models of it or just paper prints? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chief Snake Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 The M-163 is a 20mm cannon adapted from the M-161, also in 20mm. The configuration is for use as an aerial weapon and is quite different than what you have illustrated. The M-163 has only 3 barrels so the weight of the gun is reduced for aerial applications such as on the AH-1W Cobra. The gun you have illustrated is very much like the most modern application of the M-134, 7.62mm "minigun". As pictured this weapon is fitted to be used as a "doorgun" by helicopters such as the UH/MH-60 Blackhawk family and on CH/MH-47 Chinook aircraft. There certainly may be other types of aircraft the gun is used on. Your depictions are excellant! Chris M aka Chief Snake Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Quixote74 Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 The M-163 is a 20mm cannon adapted from the M-161, also in 20mm. The configuration is for use as an aerial weapon and is quite different than what you have illustrated. The M-163 has only 3 barrels so the weight of the gun is reduced for aerial applications such as on the AH-1W Cobra. The gun you have illustrated is very much like the most modern application of the M-134, 7.62mm "minigun". As pictured this weapon is fitted to be used as a "doorgun" by helicopters such as the UH/MH-60 Blackhawk family and on CH/MH-47 Chinook aircraft. There certainly may be other types of aircraft the gun is used on. Your depictions are excellant!Chris M aka Chief Snake Armoryman's model is an accurate M134, but there's some confusion in the other "family members" that you mentioned. The original 20mm "Vulcan" aircraft cannon is the M61, used in most U.S. fighters from the F-104 through the F-22. The three-barreled lightweight derivative used by the late-model AH-1s is actually the M197. The M163 is actually the Vulcan Air Defense System - the mobile anti-aircraft gun system mounting a Vulcan turret on an M113 chassis. Armoryman, I'm not an expert on the M134 but your 3D model looks great to me. I think the main question is what scale you plan to produce it in. Judging by the complexity I'm assuming 1/48 or larger? Depending on barrel length and flash suppressor type, it should work on the A/M/OH-6, H/UH-1, MH-47, MH-53, and H/MH-60. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chief Snake Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Armoryman's model is an accurate M134, but there's some confusion in the other "family members" that you mentioned. The original 20mm "Vulcan" aircraft cannon is the M61, used in most U.S. fighters from the F-104 through the F-22. The three-barreled lightweight derivative used by the late-model AH-1s is actually the M197. The M163 is actually the Vulcan Air Defense System - the mobile anti-aircraft gun system mounting a Vulcan turret on an M113 chassis.Armoryman, I'm not an expert on the M134 but your 3D model looks great to me. I think the main question is what scale you plan to produce it in. Judging by the complexity I'm assuming 1/48 or larger? Depending on barrel length and flash suppressor type, it should work on the A/M/OH-6, H/UH-1, MH-47, MH-53, and H/MH-60. Man, I need to shut up. Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SuperCobra Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Man, I need to shut up.Chris It wouldn't like as bad if the OP hadn't gone back after the fact and edited his post to correct 163 to 134! If I were you, I'd go back and edit your post into a random cat fact. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rotorwash Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) I have been watching this thread and debated on replying because I knew I'd go overboard, but what the heck. First off, I like the 3D model. Looks to represent the newer style of miniguns seen in birds such as this HH-60G: I see the selenoid but I can't see what is supposed to represent the feeder-delinker. Maybe the newer ones have it enclosed in a housing. Anyway, you might want to consider making a generic gun without the grips and then make grips and other mounting brackets separately. That would give you the most flexibility. Over 9,300 M134s have been produced and Dillon Aero is still cranking them out. Here are a few of the different systems that have used the M-134 through the years. First, the M134 itself: M134 in the door of a HAL-3 (Det 3) UH-1B: M-28 turret on a AH-1S: XM-93 system on a 20th SOS UH-1P: M-18 gun pod with cover removed: M-27 system on a OH-6A: M-27 on an OH-58A: Vietnam Nighthawk setup on UH-1H: Finally, the very early TAT 102 configuration on an AH-1G: As you can see I am a Minigun fan! Ray Edited December 4, 2009 by rotorwash Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rotorwash Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Holy cow I almost forgot the most important system of all, the M-21. Here are some pics of dad's gunship along with a few extra M 134 shots. Ray Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aaronw Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) Since this seems to be the minigun thread, is the top one the single flash suppressor version mentioned and the bottom one the individual barrel flash suppressor style? I've often wondered what the large ring at the end on some mini-guns was for, it seemed quite large for a brace. Edited December 4, 2009 by Aaronw Quote Link to post Share on other sites
arkhunter2002 Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) These are the single flash supressors (old version of the barrel clamp) and the new version: Take care, Austin Edited December 4, 2009 by arkhunter2002 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Armoryman Posted January 8, 2010 Author Share Posted January 8, 2010 Thanks a lot for all of You!!! All the protos really helped! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thatguy96 Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 (edited) Armoryman's model is an accurate M134, but there's some confusion in the other "family members" that you mentioned. The original 20mm "Vulcan" aircraft cannon is the M61, used in most U.S. fighters from the F-104 through the F-22. The three-barreled lightweight derivative used by the late-model AH-1s is actually the M197. The M163 is actually the Vulcan Air Defense System - the mobile anti-aircraft gun system mounting a Vulcan turret on an M113 chassis. The variant used on the M163 and M167 VADS and Towed VADS is the M168. There was also the short-barreled M195 version used on the M35 armament subsystem. The US Army test 2 different types of pre-M197 cannon during the early 1960s as well, both with 3 barrels. One had 3 standard length barrels, while the other had 3 barrels that were 30" shorter than usual. M-27 system on a OH-6A:http://lh5.ggpht.com/_f8ldizutzFw/SxhdOa9_...iU/s800/M27.jpg M-27 on an OH-58A: http://lh4.ggpht.com/_f8ldizutzFw/SxhdNeOO...rmament0046.jpg The first one is the XM27E1/M27 and the second one is the M27E1. Also, between the US Army, US Navy, and US Air Force, there were 4 types of TAT-102 turret used. The Army used the TAT-102A on the AH-1G, the US Navy used the TAT-102C on the HH-3A and TAT-102K on the HH-2C, while the US Air Force used the TAT-102B on the CH/HH-3E. The TAT-102B and-102C were essentially self-contained pods with a TAT-102 series turret and appear to only differ in the helicopter they were intended to be used on. TAT-102B from USAF Helicopter Pilots Association The following two images represent the two most common ways to mount the M134 to the H-60 airframe. The first is newer. Its the Air Force's A/A49E-13 system. The other is based on the original M144 armament subsystem for the US Army. They differ primarily in that the USAF's A/A49E-13 is completely external, with the mount attached to the land gear sponson and the ammunition magazine attached to the outside of the aircraft's fuselage. A companion system the A/A49E-14 was also developed and is virtually identical, except that it mounts the GAU-21/A .50 caliber machine gun. Both use the new L-bracket type pintle adapter, now supplied by Dillon Aero. The USMC uses the Defensive Armament System (designated A/A49E-11) to attach the M134 to the UH-1N helicopter. The first iterations utilized the heavier pintle mounting, while the current versions use the improved L-bracket. Early Current A less common version, the A/A49E-3, featured the same ammunition feed and magazine as the M93, but with mounting hardware more similar to the M23/M59 armament subsystems. A similar system is currently offered by Dillon Aero with up to 3 positions for the pintle. Note also that M134 can generally be substituted for GAU-2B/A as the official designation for the Minigun in either the US Army or USAF nomenclature systems. The M134 designation has not changed since the weapon's introduction, while the USAF saw fit to designate various improvements with separate subvariants (GAU-2/A, GAU-2A/A, and lastly GAU-2B/A). The differences between these weapons and the GAU-17/A is not entirely clear to me, but I believe the GAU-17/A designation is used to indicate new production Dillon Aero weapons. The US Navy also has the Mk 25 Mod 0 nomenclature for some variant and there is some scattered references to GAU-2C (possibly C/A) on the internet. Edited January 8, 2010 by thatguy96 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrittMac Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 TAT turrets on HH-3's? That is something I had never seen until now. Very very cool, thanks for putting that one up, and thanks for all the info too. Brandon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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